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Topic: Development on Hold for awhile.

Hey guys,, there will not be any updates on the projects for a while, I'm setting them both aside.  (hibernating them)
As  I have a lot of home renovations to do, including adding a new room to the house here.
I'll be doing all the work myself to save money, this leaves little or time for anything else.

When I finished, I'm coming back full time to get the next playable out.
Thats a promise.

AXSX Lead

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Thanks for the update, and good luck with your renovations!

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Go ahead, your wellfare comes first. Good luck with your renovations!

.-.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Another house renovation for Andrew? Gonna post some more pics for us to show how it goes? As far as AXSX goes I've got all the time in the world.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Here guys I'm just here to share a post Andrew made on the SRetro forums to clarify the AXSX project being on hold a little.

Posted by Andrew75 at http://forums.sonicretro.org/index.php? … p;p=728646
This project has always had so many hair pulling technical hurdles slowing it down, its not as easy as compared to making your standard sonic game.
We are still facing many technical problems, with collisions, cameras, and a few small random issues that even a some pro programmers have become stumped over.
(mainly because of the nature for system combinations such as World rotations, Rotating gravity system, fisheye and how udk handles collisions vs the previous mentioned)
I've been in contact with various professional programmers in the game industry who could not help salve some of the issues. (one from Lionhead studios, EA games and Raven software to name a few)
Some programmers simply looked at the code and said some things are impossible given the complexity of the requirements and the way UDK is set up.
I'm actually thinking to pay someone in the future to help finish programming for this project.
I think its a burden, and a real pain for Xak, Xeniczone, and a few others who did the main programming, having me on there heals requesting fixes all the time.
Its not a simple project by any means, and right now I have the feeling to quit in frustration. Always seems to be some new issues popping up.
(but you know what? the other side of my conscious says I really should keep going to finish what I started)
By the time the game is finished, I have the feeling only a hand full of you will even be interested in playing this game, since it does not follow the traditional Sonic formula.

Posted by Andrew75 at http://forums.sonicretro.org/index.php? … p;p=728901
Right now the project has a few technical setbacks that don't seem to be working out.
Some areas in many levels will be 100% unplayable because of some of these technical problems.
Its hard to be motivated and want to continue work on levels, as I'm afraid that if I do, than many months of modeling, and level set up work to come will be wasted.

Not to mention the past few months of official Def file clean up.
Had to clean up over 35 official levels containing 1000s of polygons 1 by 1, so that they would be 100% optimized and ready for the game engine.
Even after doing all that, it may not matter if they are not going to work in the engine.
So basically the project is stuck at a stand still with lots of assets just sitting around waiting to be finished, since I'm afraid to finish them.
If I cant get these issues fixed , it will mean the end to Project AXSX (sonic xtreme) for sure.

Until I get the issues salved by finding, or hiring someone who would help fix them.
AXSX is going to be sleeping for awhile.
In the mean time I'll resume work on the easier 2.5D HD Sonic CD Remix.

So basically we're here at a stand still because he either leaves the progress where it is or proceeds without a clear direction. We all knew this project would take a long time (and it has) so hopefully we all can agree that this extended wait isn't something to be overly discouraged about. Fact is since the move to the new engine there has been faster progress so who knows what will come up in the coming months.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Yeah holds like this are not un-common for the project.
News flash:
I've made a deal with someone that if i model a level for there Sonic GDK project,
That they will help fix the issues we have with AXSX, Hopefully this detour wont take long.
The level is Angel Island Zone in HD 2.5D
The name for the project is Sonic-3KD

Normally I dont care to show for (Work in progress) test shaders or models
but here is a quick peek.
http://img801.imageshack.us/img801/3103/podaq.png

Background textures are just test shaders here,
http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/1128/pod2.png

AXSX Lead

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

It seems every new engine that comes out always it's problems with SX rotation. It's just like 1996 again, when the orginal developers had similar issues with sonic. Maybe was his speed sprites when he was in his almost full sprinting stages, somewhat when he hit a certain wall when he suposed to was traveling certain direction of some sort.

.-.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Liking the thought of a 3D Sonic 3.... so long as they keep the proper physics intact and layouts that promote them.

Also good to know that this little issue is already being looked into.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Sonickku wrote:

It seems every new engine that comes out always it's problems with SX rotation. It's just like 1996 again, when the orginal developers had similar issues with sonic. Maybe was his speed sprites when he was in his almost full sprinting stages, somewhat when he hit a certain wall when he suposed to was traveling certain direction of some sort.

Thank god that the main issue is just with the camera , ( other issues are minor)
It goes ape shit when sonic follows a pre-defined path. (The paths are used for some of the auto extruding areas)


the0nlykyd wrote:

Liking the thought of a 3D Sonic 3.... so long as they keep the proper physics intact and layouts that promote them.
.

So far things are heading that way.

AXSX Lead

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Truth be told I've been thinking for years on ways to make 3D Sonic games feel more like the originals. I'd love to have some creative input in games but my skills really stop there. If I were more tech savvy I'd probably put a lot of effort into my own project.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

As cool as these project are, i think it's a bad idea to make too much at the same time. You may finish one project before jumping to a next one. I don't want to imagine to many awesome project being cancelled at the same time. Please finish AXSX first, them continue with other cool project.

I'm a french Canadian, so don't hurt me if my english can seem odd at time.
My youtube page: http://www.youtube.com/user/ZoneofDoom

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

The purpose for him doing helping with this Sonic 3KD is so he can have help fixing issues he's having with AXSX.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

AleX-treme wrote:

As cool as these project are, i think it's a bad idea to make too much at the same time. You may finish one project before jumping to a next one. I don't want to imagine to many awesome project being cancelled at the same time. Please finish AXSX first, them continue with other cool project.

Wish I could, but with bugs that i can not squash on my own, I need to take on this job, out of necessity.
For the most part i agree with you 100%.

AXSX Lead

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

the0nlykyd wrote:

Truth be told I've been thinking for years on ways to make 3D Sonic games feel more like the originals. I'd love to have some creative input in games but my skills really stop there. If I were more tech savvy I'd probably put a lot of effort into my own project.

Go for it man !
I never thought i would be making an actual game, I joined the project originally as an art guy helping Xeniczone add a metal sonic model for his boss engine.

AXSX Lead

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Yeah but you're actually GOOD at something that can be used in a game. I don't have any experience with coding games or modeling. All I can really do is give ideas which is something EVERYONE can do.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

3D is hard only if you don't understand how easy it is !

AXSX Lead

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Sonic-Xtreme's development has historically always just been brimming with surprises. tongue

That being said, I trust Andrew's judgment, so I'm sure whatever happens is all for the best.

Andrew75 wrote:
Sonickku wrote:

It seems every new engine that comes out always it's problems with SX rotation. It's just like 1996 again, when the orginal developers had similar issues with sonic. Maybe was his speed sprites when he was in his almost full sprinting stages, somewhat when he hit a certain wall when he suposed to was traveling certain direction of some sort.

Thank god that the main issue is just with the camera , ( other issues are minor)
It goes ape shit when sonic follows a pre-defined path. (The paths are used for some of the auto extruding areas)

Just a thought (perhaps/I'm sure it's already come up): Would scripting a camera to follow the automated path (say, make the auto-paths act entirely like a pre-rendered scene) work?

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Been there, done that.

AXSX Lead

19 (edited by Moop 2013-02-09 01:20:20)

Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Figured.

Let's see if I can guess what you've thought of...
-Side-scroller
-Fixed point rotation
-"On rails" rotation
-Camera "switching" depending on gravity (like, a fixed camera at each spot needed--I feel like that's one of the first things you tried, though)
-Curved/square path camera (Also, I feel like that was an early thought)
-Series of cameras that "jump" to each other as the path progresses
-No camera
-Totally stationary camera
-Start and end cameras
-Flyby cameras
-"Follow me"-style cameras (I think the official term is "over the shoulder")
-Isometric angle camera (only one that looks down on the whole path at an angle)
-Whatever it is that Google Sketchup uses for its orbit tool (or 3DS Max, I guess; they might be the same)
-Sonic Adventure's idea of a "free camera" (minus the infamous issues with it)
-Camera "collision," where having a set of invisible walls bump it into the right spot when it hits them
-Some kind of mirror effect until the path ends
-The style that Super Monkey Ball uses for its replays (where you can change the perspective, except in this case the switching is done with trigger points instead of a button--but, again, that's probably another really obvious one)
-Inserting a straight up cut-scene that looks identical to the gameplay (based on the above response, I'd assume this failed, too)
-Stringing together hundreds of images (one per frame) of each position on the path @ 60fps (This might very well just be a bad idea, though)
-A purposeful rendition of Sonic 2's "The camera's too slow to keep up!" in Chemical Plant Zone
-Some kind of motion blur effect to hide the camera's screwiness

Bearing in mind that I really have no clue about how game engines implement cameras, nor do some of those make any particular literal sense, I'm probably the last one to be trying to figure anything out. I'm just hoping that maybe on an off chance something can trigger an idea that'll be feasible.  hmm

That being said, sometimes just a break can do some good. Never hurts to look at something with a fresh/revitalized set of eyes!

Edit: By the way, those renders for Sonic-3KD look stellar!

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Thanks for the ideas, but the camera needs to be locked onto sonic, because of fisheye.
The main problem is that the camera wants tilt up and down when he runs on ramps facing towards or away from the screen,
There does not seem to be a way to lock the axis individuality in udk.
The guy that im doing the level for has got things covered though.
He seems very positive he can pull it off. So no worries.

Also that sonic 3 screen is Realtime.

AXSX Lead

21 (edited by Moop 2013-02-09 16:08:34)

Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Really? It looks amazing! I'll definitely need to try that game when it's done!

But that's good to hear about the camera. Weird that something so simple doesn't seem to have been implemented in a "just works" kind of way.  Of course, there's always the possibility of building a custom extension to the development kit to do what you want, but since you've got it covered I doubt it needs to go that far. big_smile

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Andrew75 wrote:
Sonickku wrote:

It seems every new engine that comes out always it's problems with SX rotation. It's just like 1996 again, when the orginal developers had similar issues with sonic. Maybe was his speed sprites when he was in his almost full sprinting stages, somewhat when he hit a certain wall when he suposed to was traveling certain direction of some sort.

Thank god that the main issue is just with the camera , ( other issues are minor)
It goes ape shit when sonic follows a pre-defined path. (The paths are used for some of the auto extruding areas)


the0nlykyd wrote:

Liking the thought of a 3D Sonic 3.... so long as they keep the proper physics intact and layouts that promote them.
.

So far things are heading that way.

That explains why the project can't do tubes. And I know That 3D is simple but yet so complex to work out problems such as this.

.-.

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

so hope this project is not cancelled!

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Not cancled

AXSX Lead

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Re: Development on Hold for awhile.

Andrew75 wrote:

Not cancled

yay

Me like pie